Saturday 14 December 2013

Please heed this warning NSW/Sydney Paintballers.

Welcome every one to my experience. I hope to educate those who have no experience in paintball or either thinking of Purchasing from the *International Paintball Group*.

(Please go below for my Financial report comparison and my personal, unbiased advice)

Firstly, I would like to describe my first encounter with the so called "International Paintball Group".
I have never been paintball before though I have researched quite extensively about the sport. One afternoon in a local westfields shopping centre, I wondered towards one of the Paintball stands in the middle of the walkway. I was greeted by what seemed like a very humble and polite bloke who was keen in getting me a package deal with their group IPG (International Paintball Group). The encounter was quite satisfying and I thought I was getting a sweet deal by purchasing 4 tickets for the price of $160, which included an extra 16 tickets, individually being $40. He managed to entice me even further by *upgrading* to a platinum membership expiry, which was 2 years in total 1.5 years more than the lowest package.
He also further provided 100 free paintballs from a higher package *free* on the day of booking.
At this point I could no longer stand the deal and simply gave away $160 bucks for the 40 tickets in total plus a 1 year membership and a 2 year expiry.
However, I was NOT informed of the $50 dollar per person payment fee when you book through the phone and they MUST be paid via either credit card or direct transfer, NOT on the day of the event.
Additionally, they had locations around NSW such as Heartbreak Ridge Paintball in Blacktown and Appin. The only thing is, when had a look online at the ACTUAL businesses such as Heartbreak Ridge paintball, they offered a $20 entrance fee ($20 less compared to the IPG), along with great deals on their packs such as 1000 paintballs + Mcdonalds lunch +Vest for $80. When I mentioned IPG, their prices CHANGED and they told me that I would be charged $25 per 100 paintballs...
At this point, I was beginning to question the legitimacy of IPG. Mind you, it is a completely legal and valid company, HOWEVER IT IS A MARKETING COMPANY, which was NOT explained to me by the sales person. They Do Not actually own their own paintball sites, rather, they overcharge poor suckers new to paintball and only help with the booking and marketing of the various paintball brands.
At this point in time, I hope to receive a refund for the UNINFORMED details that have been hiding from me at the shopping centre consultation.

Lets do some maths. (Note: Figures are quoted as of 15/12/2013. Changes may occur, please check the respective websites for notices) 
-Heartbreak Ridge is the name/brand of the actual paintball complex. http://www.paintball.net.au/
-IPG is a Marketing company and does NOT OWN the various paintball complexes, rather, they assist in marketing the various paintball locations (+ in my experience and calculations, charge you more). http://www.ipgau.com.au

NOTE: Both are for entry and fun in the SAME COMPLEX, however, the method of entry and who you pay is the variable. Pay either to Heartbreak Ridge or to the Marketing company IPG.


        Financial Report Comparison (Correct as of 15/12/2013)


No# of people: 10
No# of bullets Per person: 1000pbs (Constant firing throughout the day) [Amount chosen as bulk buying is always at the cheapest Rates]{Total paintballs 10000pbs}

Through Heartbreak Ridge (Blacktown):

  • Upon placing booking a fee of $20pp is required for entry. (Can be either paid via credit card or upon arrival at the complex- available from Wed-Sun 7:30am-2:30pm)   x10                          +$200
  • "Terminator Pack" $80pp, which includes 1000 paint balls for each player, 'Battle Vest' and a Mcdonalds medium Meal x10                                                                                                        +800   
  • "Organiser Bonus",  +200 free paintballs + free gun upgrade x10                                               +0   
Total: $1000 for 10 people 
      • 1000pbs per player
      • equipment hire/entry
      • including food


Through International Paintball Group(Blacktown):
  • "VIP" tickets (10 tickets a page) for $40 each. Includes gear and equipment hire. x 10             +400   
  • Additional $40pp required upfront during booking and 200pb per person(Cannot be paid on site, must be paid via phone or transfer) x10                                                                                   +400      
  • (As each player already has 200 pbs, totalling 2000, an additional 8000 paint balls is required to total 10 000, which is the control in this report as 10 000 paintballs in total equates to the control of 1000 paintballs per person) $320 for 2000 best available bulk buy discount rate.              x4                                                                                                                   +1280   
Total: $2080 (~+$15pp for food and drinks i.e +$150 ontop of this price of $2080) for 10 people 
      • 1000pbs per player
      • equipment hire/entry
      • NOT including food

This comparison clearly illustrates the pricing difference of marketing schemes compared to the actual complex venue. Even after calculating the maths, I am quite shocked at the different in pricing that the Marketing blokes increase upon the expenses. 
There is a minimum of $1000 difference when booking and paying IPG's prices compared to the actual venue's prices.  

My advice is to STEER CLEAR of marketing companies for the paintball venues and purchase EVERYTHING AND BOOK THROUGH THE ACTUAL VENUE. By doing so, you save yourself a truckload of money($1000 minimum based on a 10 player, 1000bullets each and entry fees) as well as supporting the financial revenue of the actual venues. Now I remind again that I am in no way affiliated with Heartbreak, Just a bloke that wants to warn other poor souls in getting the wrong prices for the wrong reasons. 



 I am in NO WAY affiliated with either Heartbreak Ridge or IPG or any paintball companies mentioned in the report, rather I am taking my free will to express my experience to the public. All calculations have been initiated and carried out by myself based on website figures which are correct as of 15/12/2013. I have a legal right to express my testimony and am legally allowed to express my own opinion. 

17 comments:

  1. Excellent post Jore!! We have shared this on our Facebook page "Paintball Ticket Complaints" - https://www.facebook.com/paintballticketcomplaints/posts/510586139048532

    Jump over and check it out!!

    ReplyDelete
  2. My son and 7 of his friends had an excellent day at Delta Force, Appin today. Would have been a hell of a lot cheaper without the IPG scammers doing exactly as Joel described. Who was to know? As uneducated buyers being first timers (and thats who IPG they rely on for the scam)it's let the buyer beware. Unless Delta Force and IPG are ultimately owned by the same entity, and I suspect they are, why would Delta Force allow a third party marketing company stitch their customers up so thoroughly. But then again everyone at IPG is South African so I suspect it's an international tried and tested scam. Which is a shame as Delta Force is a great facility but if they are the same business entity as IPG they should be ashamed of themselves. This has obviously been going on a long time as its now 2016 and Joels original comment is 2012 so if Delta Force was going to do something about their customers being screwed they would have done it by now and dont forget this is international run out of South Africa. Anyhoo there will always be enough first timers like me to keep the IPG scam profitable for a long time to come.

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  3. Anyone in Australia considering using IPG consider this. What you pay to IPG actually
    gets you nothing. They tell you it covers your entry to any of their courses (by the way
    that don't own or operate any centres) for a full day and that there are games on
    everyday, both of which are untrue. They also tell you that it covers your gear
    hire, again untrue. I was sold a package of 10 tickets for the price of 4 tickets, a total
    cost of $180.00. When I then made a booking for a course for 6 people, firstly I was
    told that i had to choose a morning or afternoon session, therefore not all day as advised
    by their salesperson. I was then told that I had to pay $45.00 in advance, non-refundable,
    for every player, plus an additional booking fee. This additional $45 was for the
    first 200 paintballs according to IPG and to confirm the booking. The day arrived and
    we went to the course. The first thing that happened was an argument over our booking
    being a full day, as agreed with IPG, with the course manager saying that we were only
    to be there for a half day. Then to my great surprise I find out that by going directly
    to the course operator and paying them $50, instead of paying IPG, anything at all, it
    included the use of the course and the supply of all the equipment including the
    marker, additional paintballs are extra, and that's fine and understandable Therefore it
    was at this point that I truly found out what IPG does. They are an agent who misleads
    you into believing you're getting a great deal, when in fact they are just a booking
    service. IPG does not own any paintball courses, nor do they operate any paintball
    courses, they dishonestly lead you to believe they do. What you are paying to them
    actually gets you nothing, just a booking service. You can go direct to any paintball
    centre and avoid paying IPG their booking fee.

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  4. oh my god two months ago I purchased the tickets and like i was just now looking to book and now wtf am i supposed to do????

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  5. I had a similar negative experience this morning. Tried to book but they could not process my credit card and had no other payment method to buy the balls. Keep in mind, I already purchased my tickets through IPG with this credit card?? Mind you this was in a mall, in person. They did not offer any solutions and said I could not just go to the park and purchase my balls on site. I now had to call a friend and see if they can book it and pay them back. I already have buyers regret and will need to wait an see whether this was a total waste of my money. Never again will I fall for something like this.

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  6. I agree 100% with the above. We have IPG in Sweden as well, and it is the same story. Irresistable offers at the malls, which you later find out are real scams. Fortunately non-profit paintball clubs have managed to get them banned from the biggest malls in Stockholm.

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  7. Totally agree with all of the above also. My brother purchased a pack of these prepaid vouchers for my bachelor party only to find it was more expensive to use them vs going direct to the grounds they outsource too. Then they find any excuse not to refund during the cooling off. Totally misleading conduct. I've told everybody I know to keep away from these guys and I certainly won't be using them again.

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  8. omg, I wish I found this post earlier, I'm in New Zealand, brought this ticket from west field mall, it is total scam, when I called to make a booking, it charged me $25 per person for 100 bullets, for the actual paintball place, it actually is running promtion, much cheaper than this the scam deal, is can not believe this scam still survived in 2019,so disappointed people still allow thus IPG company to cheating people

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  9. Pretty bad in Hamilton Ontario as well. Since it was a major scam down here I'm taking the bastards to court!

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  10. These scammers have ripped my mrs off I'm a paintballer so she thought it would be a good idea to buy me a 70 quid package from a stall in a Tesco lobby she has no idea about paintballing and it's these people that they pray on what a con the tickets are worthless if i used them it would cost me about 80 quid in balls yet if i don't i can get a better package by booking directly with the paintball companies of my choice for 50 quid now the mrs is upset with me for not liking the gift she was scammed into but i can't ask 20 freind to pay a extra 30 quid on top of our normal price to keep her happy plus the closest venue it 40 miles away from where she was sold them what a joke you've been warned rant over

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  11. I met these guys at a Westfield. They tried to push some great deal only if I bought today, at that time I walked away because I always like to research it before I buy. Googled a bit that afternoon and found It to be heaps cheaper if you go directly to the individual company's and not through a marketing company like IPG. Im glad I didn't waste my money and im suppriesd this is still happening.
    IPG is just a booking company who will make money from you, in return you get a worse deal then if you go directly to a paintballing company.

    ReplyDelete
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  13. On the 14 April 2022 I was approached by a salesman at the Sydney Royal Easter Show. The salesman used high pressure sales tactics; promising us ‘discounted vouchers’ for NEXT LEVEL PAINTBALL boasting the top rated paintball fields in Australia and worldwide, which included free equipment hire, guns, 100 paintballs, helmet and entry at vastly reduced cost.

    The voucher was ‘valued’ at $40.00 per person offering us the packages for $9 per person or less. All we had to do was secure our date with a $25 per head ‘deposit’, (which we later found out was misleading as the deposit did not go toward anything but was actually a ‘prepayment’.)
    On the 15 December 2022 we contacted Next Level Paintball to organise our 40 person event by placing a ‘prepayment’ (instead of ‘deposit’ as it was now referred to by the booking office) for x2 registrations to secure our date and the remaining 38 to be paid within 2 weeks. During the processing of the payment the operator advised us of a $1.50 per person handling fee which was no where listed on the purchased voucher. Rather, this was noted on the receipt only after we had made the payment.

    Following this telephone conversation we were provided a link which could be forwarded onto the remaining 38 participants to complete their paintball registration.

    Upon further review of the registration link we identified that the link was directed to Delta Force Paintball, not Next Level Paintball. When we clicked on the pricing tab in the link provided it advises that the cheapest package is 90.00 per person which includes equipment hire, guns, 500 paintballs, helmet and entry.

    Next, we googled Next Level Paintball which advises that if you have a discount voucher then this can be used towards a paintball package – cheapest package is 90.00 for 500 paintballs.

    So essentially the voucher has no value as I have to pay 90.00 for 500 paintballs either way. In fact it’s a considerably worse deal because of the 25.00 prepayment and 1.50 handling fee. So the discount voucher through Next Level Paintball actually charged an ‘idiot’ fee of 26.50.

    My husband has contacted the paintball office a dozen times over the past week to discuss the value of the vouchers and at each attempt the line either gets disconnected, management is too busy to take an escalation call or an operator promises to call back at an agreed time but they never do.

    Upon further investigations we have identified that Next Level Paintball does not own any paintball fields as sold to us. Rather, they are a marketing company formally known as International Paintball Group (IPG) which has had their trade name thoroughly burnt out, inundated with complaints which has earned them international notoriety. It was with this set up that the call centre operators continually claimed no liability for any complaints; their excuse was they were not affiliated with Delta Force, then later that they were not even responsible for Next Level Paintball itself but a different company entirely called “Paintball Booking Office”. This is even though we called the phone number for Next Level.


    Joe Lycett calling out IPG https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxOG5aLM2YU


    Have notified ACCC, Fair Trading, The Royal Eastershow and left several bad reviews. Also wrote to ACA and Scott Pape. If any comments or people want to coordinate to take down this fraudulent company email me at rajorshi13@gmail.com






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  14. - They use deceptive mathematics to convince you that you got a good deal
    - The $40 dollar ticket price is fake to make the discount seem more appealing
    - The salesmen told me the $25 dollar “prepayment” was a deposit which could go towards a group package which was a lie. This conversation obviously isn’t recorded anywhere so he will get away with that.
    - The $25 prepayment actually pays for the first 100 paintballs which they call “free” and ‘included’ with the prepayment– an example of deceptive language
    - You can’t call something free if you are paying for it – an example of deceptive marketing tactic
    - On the discount voucher they call the $25 prepayment a “deposit” in one particular paragraph to intentionally confuse the reader – an example of deceptive language
    - This $25 “deposit” is actually not put towards anything (except for the “FREE” 100 paintballs which is “valued” at $25 according to the voucher book), hence not really a deposit – an example of deceptive language.
    - When pressed about the above they will claim the $25 “deposit” buys ANOTHER 100 paintballs meaning 200 paintballs. This is a lie.
    - You have no way of verifying the lie with the paintball centre itself as the Delta Force direct line is permanently disconnected.
    - You can only contact the staff of the venue to discuss pricing if you show up to the paintball centre which is hours away from the city centre.
    - When you do show up, as other reviewers have pointed out, they will lie about the number of paintballs you’ve bought and try to give you less. Here all lies regarding pricing and number of paintballs are exposed but it’s too late to do anything about it.
    - The sales people, from in-person, to on-the-phone, to at-the-centre will be willing to lie just enough to get you over the line.
    - What results from their lie is simply kicking the can-of-lies down the road to the next salesperson in the chain to deal with your anger when the customer finally cracks on to the lies they’ve been sold.
    - Delta Force claims no responsibility or liability for vouchers or tickets sold by “third parties” such as Next Level Paintball
    - The phone number on the next level voucher and website directs you to another third party called “Paintball Booking Office”.
    - “Paintball Booking Office” are not Next Level Paintball or Delta Force paintball so they are not responsible for the tickets, service or pricing at all.
    - They say they will call back but they almost never do
    - They say the customer service manager is always busy
    - The person you talk to is never authorised to give you an actual good deal or refund and that is done by the higher ups.
    - The customer cannot be transferred to speak to the higher ups. Essentially after the customer service manager is a dead end.
    - They tell you that you agreed to the terms and conditions of the voucher which includes no refunds after 10 days.
    - They tell you that you agreed to pay a handling fee
    - They also say that the agreed terms on the discount voucher is subject to change without notice on their end.
    - From reviews I’ve read, not my personal experience but every reason to believe it’s true, the few times they offer a refund they say they are not authorised to refund immediately, they must apply for the refund which can only be done after 7 days
    - After the 7 days the refund takes time to be processed, which can be another 15 days.
    - By the time the transition days end the buyer is told they are outside the cooling off period.
    - If the refund actually is “processed” the customer sees after 15 days that the money has not been received in their account

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  15. My Rebuttals
    - The sales person uses misleading and deceptive language, claiming they are a top-rated paintball company with the best paintball fields
    - The sales person uses deceptive language, omitting the fact that Next Level Paintball does not own any paintball fields
    - The discount voucher falsely claims their service is worth 40 dollars per person when in fact it has no value
    - By the law of mathematics, even the best packages in combo with the vouchers are the same price as the actual value listed directly by the paintball centre on their website – typically $90.
    - It will then be more expensive because of the handling fees involved.
    - The handling fee is not discussed in writing and is only mentioned verbally when it’s time to pull out your card over the phone. Only after this do they send a confirmation email saying there is a handling fee.
    - The contract I’ve signed is illegal; I legally cannot agree to sign my consumer rights away (see below about consumer guarantees)
    - The contract terms included the lack of a refund and lack of resolution after escalating your complaint with the company is illegal under Australian consumer law.
    Each party can claim they are a different company and it’s not their fault or responsibility etc but it has been going on for so many years in so many countries and has received so many complaints that if Delta Force or IPG or its Australian equivalent Next Level Paintball wanted to do something about it they would have done it by now.

    ReplyDelete
  16. Actual maths breakdown

    This is what Next Level advertises – $40 per person fee which included free equipment hire, guns, paintballs, helmet and entry at vastly reduced cost of $9 per person. We had a party of 40 people.

    So $9 x 40people = $360
    Then ($25”prepayment” + $1.50 handling fee) x 40people = $1,060 upfront.
    Cheapest group package ($90/500 paintballs - $9“prepayment”) x 40people = $3240
    Total $360 + $1060 + $3240 = $4660 out of pocket for the party or $116.50 per person

    If you take the fine print of 100 increments of additional paintballs for $14 to purchase extra 400 paintballs for 500 total paintballs:
    Then $14 x 4(100 paintballs) = $56 per person
    $56/400 paintballs x 40people = $2240
    $2240 + $1060 + $360 = $3660 for the party or $91.50 per person

    They were not planning to honour this $14/100 paintball stipulation, see my conversation with the CSM above.
    They would have told me it was $25 per 100 paintballs if I showed up on the day and the CSM offered me an “exclusive package” of 500 paintballs for $81 per person.
    $81 / 4(100paintballs) = $20.25 per 100 additional paintballs.
    This is worse than what the voucher was already offering me had they planned to honour it.
    Anyway using her math, $81+ $9 as per the voucher would = $91.50 per person including handling fee.
    Imagine if you didn’t have a discount voucher and actually paid $40 to book with Next Level then another $90 for the package of paintballs. It makes me shudder so you can do that math on that.

    Now if you didn’t purchase NLP vouchers and book with Delta Force as advertised on their website:
    entry + equipment + 500 paintballs = $90 per person

    ReplyDelete
  17. https://jitubengaltiger.blogspot.com/

    My blog post on the subject

    ReplyDelete